ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

USB headsets to digital audio workstation software...
Dick
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Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:49 pm

ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:40 pm

In a private exchange with Scott I asked a question about getting ANAN-200D and VM Banana running again. Scott suggested I carry on this work here.

I have been following the instructions presented here ===> http://wu2o.dyndns.org/wu2o_vac_tutorial_2.html
==============================
To setup VMB for digital mode operation, the steps are as follows:



Step 1: with all audio related programs including VMB closed, using Windows Sound Control Panel, open each VMB related audio device you see (e.g. "Voicemeeter Aux Input"), go to the Advanced Setting tab and set them to 16 or 24 bit, 2 channel, 48KHz. Be sure to do this for both Playback and Recording devices.

................. 24 bit 48000 Hz (Studio Quality) PLAYBACK (Voicemeeter Aux Input) VB-Audio Voicemeeter AUX VAIO ... Green check marked
24 bit 48000 Hz (studio Quality) PLAYBACK (Voicemeeter Input) VB-Audio Voicemeeter VAIO
2 channel 24 bit 48000 Hz (Studio Quality) RECORDING (voicemeeter Aux Output) VB-Audio Voicemeeter AUX VAIO ... Green checked
2 channel 24 bit 48000 Hz (studio Quality) RECORDING (Voicemeeter output) VB-Audio Voicemeeter VAIO disabled


Step 2: open Virtual IO Control Panel and, using the Options menu, set the Internal Sampling Rate to 48KHz. Do the same for the Virtual Aux IO Control Panel. Reboot the PC.

.............. VB-Audio Virtual Cable Control Panel :
Driver Name: VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO
Internal SR: 48000 Hz
Max Latency: 7168

Input: ch 2, SR 48000Hz, Res 24 bits
output: ch 2, SR 48000 Hz, Res 24 bits

............. VB-Audio Virtual Cable Control Panel :
Driver Name: VB- Audio VoiceMeeter VAIO
Internal SR: 48000 Hz
Max Latency: 7168 smp

Input: ch 2, SR: 48000 Hz, 24 bits
Output: ch 2, SR 48000 Hz, 24 bits



Step 3: Start VMB. There is an optional setting in VMB that has it run automatically when the PC boots. You may want to turn that on for future convenience.

.............. Started it and immediately below "HARDWARE OUT" (top right corner) blinking RED "Speakers (High Definition Audio Device)"


Step 4: Start PowerSDR and assign PowerSDR VAC1 to "Voicemeeter Input" and "Voicemeeter Output", 48KHz sample rate, MME driver, buffer size 2048, stereo, buffer latency auto. You can tweak all this for lowest latency later as described in Section 7 above. The first order of business is to get high quality sound. Low latency isn't a big issue for most digital modes or RTTY. However, if you want to run an ARQ mode like WINMOR, then it is critical. See Section 7 above.

...................... All set as listed above BUT there is no selection for "Buffer Latency Auto" Only choice here is to select "Manual" - unchecked

...................... POWER switch was off but I turned it ON at this time



Step 5: Start your digital mode program and assign your digital mode program to "Voicemeeter Aux Input" and "Voicemeeter Aux Output", 48KHz sample rate.

................... Input: VoiceMeeter Aux Output
Output: VoiceMeeter Aux Input

NO SELECTION available to select 48KHz so assume SW expects to get what it receives


Step 6: Click the B2 "send" button on the Voicemeeter VAIO channel strip. This will send audio received from PowerSDR on that channel strip to the digital mode program.

................. B2 selected under the "VoiceMeeter VAIO" Channel strip



Step 7: Click the B1 "send" button on the Voicemeeter AUX channel strip. This will send audio received from the digital mode program on that channel strip to PowerSDR.

................. B1 selected under the "VoiceMeeter AUX" Channel strip



Everything should be running now. It is recommended to leave the level controls in VMB set to 0dB and adjust levels in PowerSDR and the digital mode program as required, however the adjustments are there if you need them.

............... All "Level Control Sliders" set to 0dB and ALL IS NOT WELL ! Nothing happening and the blinking RED message at top right of the VMB
panel is still there. No indication of any audio on the VMB-panel meters.

So far, I am into about 10-hours of work trying to get things operational again, but still nadda !
73 Dick/w7wkr
dick.bingham@gmail.com


==============================
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w-u-2-o
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:10 pm

Dick,

Quit PowerSDR. Assign VMB output A1 to a valid hardware audio output. Make sure VMB is happy and not blinking red. Start PowerSDR. Activate VAC.

Also, if manual is not checked in PowerSDR VAC setup, then it's in auto mode ;)

73,

Scott
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:22 am

Hi Scott

Well, at the present time the following conditions exist:
1 - VoiceMeeter is shut down (AFAIK totally OFF)
2 - WSJT-X is running with the soundcard Input = VoiceMeeter Aux Output
and soundcard output = VoiceMeeter Aux Input
3 - Computer Sound Playback = Speakers (High definitionAudio device) and
Computer Sound Recording = VoiceMeeter Aux output (VB-Audio VoiceMeeter AUX VAIO)
4 - ANAN-200D <==> HPSDR Audio => VAC1 with VAC Setup Driver = MME, Input = VoiceMeeter Aux Output, Output = VoiceMeeter Aux Input

For whatever reason my DELL Laptop LATITUDE E6510 running the WSJT-X FT8 program is allowing me to make QSO's without any external cabling. I stumbled into this working combination and have NO IDEA why it is working.

I almost hate to mess with the present working SW configuration by trying your latest suggestion after 12-hours of thrashing on this problem.
Why the computer/WSJT-X with VoiceMeeter-related settings works while VoiceMeeter is shut-down, totally puzzles me.

How do I set ===> "Assign VMB output A1 to a valid hardware audio output " ? I've 'clicked' on everything possible on the VMB screen and nothing
changes.

73 Dick/w7wkr
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:46 pm

The VAIO and AUX cable constructs are actually instances of the stand-alone product, VB Cable. You seem to have successfully configured them using VMB as the user interface, and as long as VMB is not interfering with things, in this case because it is unhappy with your audio output device selection, or because it isn't running, things still work. Not that this would not be true if you were using any of the other channels in VMB.

To select a valid hardware output device for output A1, simply click A1 and select the device you want. If that does not work, then please post screen shots here of your VMB main display, and Menu > System Settings/Options in VMB.
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:46 pm

Hi Scott - others too

Where you say ===> "To select a valid hardware output device for output A1, simply click A1 and select the device you want. If that does not work.."

OK, I finally understand what I was doing wrong - selecting WDM instead of MME. VMB now has all the 'meter level indicators' working again so I'm out of the woods .

Now to figure out why the intermittent distorted FT8 signal on the PowerSDR screen happens and why WSPR operation has very few of these events happening.

Now, to figure out how to run SSB using a mic at the computer with the 200D located elsewhere. Will read the archives and proceed from there.

Thanks to all for attention to my problem/s !
73 Dick/w7wkr
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Nov 10, 2018 12:51 pm

Dick wrote:Now, to figure out how to run SSB using a mic at the computer with the 200D located elsewhere. Will read the archives and proceed from there.

Dick,

I operate exclusively in a "remote" context, and have since I started with Apache hardware and PowerSDR several years ago. My radio station lives in a rack in the basement, my operating position is in a second floor studio/office, i.e. I'm doing what you want to do every day, and it works great.

Now that you are starting to become familiar with VMB, you will see it is nothing more than a virtual mixing board/patch panel. The most important concept to understand is that of a "route", or "send", or "patch". These are audio engineer terms of art that all mean approximately the same thing. So what you need to understand is that when you push, for example, the A1 button on one of the channel strips in VMB, it routes the audio FROM that channel strip TO the A1 channel output. And so on and so forth. Hence:

1) Assign a real (not virtual) audio output device to output A1. You've already done this I think.
2) Route receive audio from the radio to that device by activating the A1 route button on Voicemeeter VAIO channel. You can leave the B2 route activated at the same time for your digi mode program if you like, there is no reason to turn it off.

You should now be able to hear receiver audio coming out of your speakers, just like your digi mode program "hears" the radio. I recommend you leave RX1 AF at 100 in PowerSDR and use the VMB master fader (lower right corner of VMB) or perhaps your speaker volume control to adjust volume, that way you don't accidentally starve your digi mode program for audio while maintaining listening levels from the speakers at a comfortable volume. However you choose to adjust volume you'll find a way that works for you.

Don't forget you can only hear RX1 via VAC1, and that Master AF in PowerSDR has no effect on VAC audio output.

3) Attach a real microphone to your PC via a real audio interface.
4) Assign that real microphone to Hardware Input 1 in VMB.
5) Route transmit audio from that VMB channel to the Voicemeeter VAIO channel by activating the B1 route on the Hardware Input 1 channel. You may want to have only a single B1 route selected depending on whether you are doing digi or phone operations, that way you don't get some accidental noises on your transmit audio. Leave PowerSDR VAC audio levels at 0dB. Use VMB to adjust microphone levels to obtain near 0dB mic level in PowerSDR.

Remember that all transmit audio processing features of PowerSDR work with VAC audio (except when DIGU or DIGL are selected), so be sure to look to some of the excellent audio setup tutorials elsewhere in the forum. You can also use the audio processing features of VMB on your microphone audio if you wish.

Finally, definitely remember to go into the Windows Sound Control Panel and explicitly set all audio devices you are using to 48KHz sample rate.

73,

Scott

P.S. once you get this working to your satisfaction, then you can work on a real PTT switch attached to your PC, and optimizing drivers and other settings to lower audio latency (delay).
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Sat Nov 10, 2018 5:20 pm

Scott

WOW! Great description of the entire set-up process. Now I will follow your suggestions to add the external mic and generate a block-diagram routing of the process so it becomes entirely clear what I am doing for future use (my memory-blanker seems to work too well)

Thank you for your time and knowledge-sharing. I imagine you will add what you have provided to me to your VAC Tutorial. It will be a great addition. I had been wondering about VMB's "Hardware Input-1/2/3" stuff

73 Dick/w7wkr
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Nov 10, 2018 6:38 pm

Dick--if these instructions work for you I'll probably post them as follow on to the VAC tutorial topic. Let's see how you make out with them.
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:32 pm

w-u-2-o wrote:
Dick wrote:Now, to figure out how to run SSB using a mic at the computer with the 200D located elsewhere. Will read the archives and proceed from there.

Dick,

I operate exclusively in a "remote" context, and have since I started with Apache hardware and PowerSDR several years ago. My radio station lives in a rack in the basement, my operating position is in a second floor studio/office, i.e. I'm doing what you want to do every day, and it works great.

Now that you are starting to become familiar with VMB, you will see it is nothing more than a virtual mixing board/patch panel. The most important concept to understand is that of a "route", or "send", or "patch". These are audio engineer terms of art that all mean approximately the same thing. So what you need to understand is that when you push, for example, the A1 button on one of the channel strips in VMB, it routes the audio FROM that channel strip TO the A1 channel output. And so on and so forth. Hence:

1) Assign a real (not virtual) audio output device to output A1. You've already done this I think.
2) Route receive audio from the radio to that device by activating the A1 route button on Voicemeeter VAIO channel. You can leave the B2 route activated at the same time for your digi mode program if you like, there is no reason to turn it off.

You should now be able to hear receiver audio coming out of your speakers, just like your digi mode program "hears" the radio. I recommend you leave RX1 AF at 100 in PowerSDR and use the VMB master fader (lower right corner of VMB) or perhaps your speaker volume control to adjust volume, that way you don't accidentally starve your digi mode program for audio while maintaining listening levels from the speakers at a comfortable volume. However you choose to adjust volume you'll find a way that works for you.

Don't forget you can only hear RX1 via VAC1, and that Master AF in PowerSDR has no effect on VAC audio output.

3) Attach a real microphone to your PC via a real audio interface.
4) Assign that real microphone to Hardware Input 1 in VMB.
5) Route transmit audio from that VMB channel to the Voicemeeter VAIO channel by activating the B1 route on the Hardware Input 1 channel. You may want to have only a single B1 route selected depending on whether you are doing digi or phone operations, that way you don't get some accidental noises on your transmit audio. Leave PowerSDR VAC audio levels at 0dB. Use VMB to adjust microphone levels to obtain near 0dB mic level in PowerSDR.

Remember that all transmit audio processing features of PowerSDR work with VAC audio (except when DIGU or DIGL are selected), so be sure to look to some of the excellent audio setup tutorials elsewhere in the forum. You can also use the audio processing features of VMB on your microphone audio if you wish.

Finally, definitely remember to go into the Windows Sound Control Panel and explicitly set all audio devices you are using to 48KHz sample rate.

73,

Scott

P.S. once you get this working to your satisfaction, then you can work on a real PTT switch attached to your PC, and optimizing drivers and other settings to lower audio latency (delay).

===========================
I followed the instructions provided and see the microphone functioning properly in the Hardware #1 input channel and am receiving receiver audio fine, too.

Speaking into the mic, I observe appropriate sound activity on the Hdw #1 level-scale along with "B1" (lower right corner of VMB) level scale .
When I press the space-bar the system goes into TX and there is ZERO output indicated on PowerSDR mRX... meter when I speak into the mic.
VMB indicates audio is generated but not being used by the ANAN-200D.

So close, but no cigar! Any more suggestions ? This represents another bunch of hours trying all sorts settings with no success at remote SSB use. Good thing my wife has been out of town (returning on the boat tomorrow at noon) for four days otherwise there would be LOTS of discontent in this family!

73 Dick/w7wkr
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Nov 10, 2018 10:55 pm

To solve the PTT problem, in Setup > Audio > VAC1, turn off (uncheck) all of the "Allow ... to override/bypass VAC for phone" options. I'll need to add that to the tutorial, eh? ;)

Future recommendation: since solutions don't seem to come to you naturally on their own, I'd recommend that if you spend more than an hour on any given problem to ask for help at that point rather than beat your head against the wall for hours at a whack.
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Sun Nov 11, 2018 1:05 am

w-u-2-o wrote:To solve the PTT problem, in Setup > Audio > VAC1, turn off (uncheck) all of the "Allow ... to override/bypass VAC for phone" options. I'll need to add that to the tutorial, eh? ;)

Future recommendation: since solutions don't seem to come to you naturally on their own, I'd recommend that if you spend more than an hour on any given problem to ask for help at that point rather than beat your head against the wall for hours at a whack.

======================
Scott, you just made my day - actually, the entire weekend! It is all working like a charm and the on-air audio has been reported as excellent.

Thank you, THANK YOU very much. Such a simple fix. Seems to me there is a song with the words "looking for love in all the wrong places ..." can be re-worded in my case to " Looking for fixes in ALL the wrong places..." I was convinced the problems were related to an improper setting related to the VMB setup.

I do need to put in the "butting the head against the wall" time otherwise the help others provide can lead to a dead-beat (let everyone else do it) expectation.

Now to fully document all of the info you have provided in my hard-paper records book and then get the place ready for the return of my tourist-wife!

Again, many thanks!

73 Dick/w7wkr
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Nov 11, 2018 12:36 pm

Dick wrote:Scott, you just made my day - actually, the entire weekend! It is all working like a charm and the on-air audio has been reported as excellent.

:)

But you are not getting off that easy. Now you need to build yourself a REAL PTT switch, either a foot or desk switch, in accordance with Section 6 of the tutorial. Do you have a serial port on your PC? If not, one of those cheap USB serial port dongles will do the trick. ;)

Also, I'm curious what mic and speakers you are using with your PC, and how they are attached? You have a lot of options. If you want to step up your game, consider upgrading those components. There are a lot of really outstanding USB microphones and speakers. Or you can step up into the big leagues and go with professional interface like the Behringer UMC202HD. Pair a 202HD ($79) with a Behringer B1 microphone ($99) and you will sound as good if not better than any other microphone on the planet (with proper PowerSDR audio setup, of course). Don't forget to look in the main PowerSDR sub-forum and check out the audio adjustment topics.

Finally, keep an eye on the release date for Voicemeeter Potato. "VMP" will have a third virtual channel and you can use that to mix VAC2 (RX2) audio into your speakers as well.
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Sun Nov 11, 2018 5:02 pm

w-u-2-o wrote:
Dick wrote:Scott, you just made my day - actually, the entire weekend! It is all working like a charm and the on-air audio has been reported as excellent.

:)

But you are not getting off that easy. Now you need to build yourself a REAL PTT switch, either a foot or desk switch, in accordance with Section 6 of the tutorial. Do you have a serial port on your PC? If not, one of those cheap USB serial port dongles will do the trick. ;)

Also, I'm curious what mic and speakers you are using with your PC, and how they are attached? You have a lot of options. If you want to step up your game, consider upgrading those components. There are a lot of really outstanding USB microphones and speakers. Or you can step up into the big leagues and go with professional interface like the Behringer UMC202HD. Pair a 202HD ($79) with a Behringer B1 microphone ($99) and you will sound as good if not better than any other microphone on the planet (with proper PowerSDR audio setup, of course). Don't forget to look in the main PowerSDR sub-forum and check out the audio adjustment topics.

Finally, keep an eye on the release date for Voicemeeter Potato. "VMP" will have a third virtual channel and you can use that to mix VAC2 (RX2) audio into your speakers as well.

=================================
Scott - Yeah, a PPT switch will be nice. The DELL laptop (LATITUDE E6510) has a 15-pin "D" connector that is probably a serial port. Have to check that out and proceed from there. I will follow your Tutorial-Instructions to proceed on that project

My microphone and speakers are someone's cast-offs I picked up for pennies at a "Thrift Store" (I'm not a cheapskate I assure you! ) They work well enough for casual SSB work on 160 and 6 meters. On-air reports say the audio sounds fine. I am so pleased to be sitting comfortably at my living-room desk chatting with folks while the radio-gear sits in an unheated - now-31F - space in the shop building.

Each speaker is slightly larger than a brick. One includes a built-in amplifier and plugs into the laptop speaker-port. Low-Fi but it works fine. A speaker/mic headset will be my next purchase (wife really dislikes the radio "noise") and it will have to be robust enough to last many years without falling apart after a year or two.

Thanks for the follow-up on my efforts to master remotely operating a PowerSDR/ANAN-200D combination.

73 Dick/w7wkr at CN98pi
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Nov 11, 2018 5:36 pm

Scott - Yeah, a PPT switch will be nice. The DELL laptop (LATITUDE E6510) has a 15-pin "D" connector that is probably a serial port. Have to check that out and proceed from there. I will follow your Tutorial-Instructions to proceed on that project

That is a VGA video port. Don't mess with it like it's a serial port or you may damage the laptop. You will need to buy a USB to serial adapter.

If you just want to cheap out on a headset, buy one of the Microsoft Lifechat USB headsets. They work pretty well.
Dick
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Re: ANAN-200D and VMB Not Working Together

Postby Dick » Sun Nov 11, 2018 6:15 pm

Scott - OK on the VGA-port. I guess the purchase of a dedicated newer non-laptop computer for Ham use and a big screen to allow PowerSDR mRX... and other digital applications to be displayed at once instead of the always being "visually stepped-on" laptop format. That would get rid of the serial-port issue too.

Any recommendations for a decent (robust structure) head-set, not a cheap-o one?

Dick/w7wkr
==============================================================
w-u-2-o wrote:
Scott - Yeah, a PPT switch will be nice. The DELL laptop (LATITUDE E6510) has a 15-pin "D" connector that is probably a serial port. Have to check that out and proceed from there. I will follow your Tutorial-Instructions to proceed on that project

That is a VGA video port. Don't mess with it like it's a serial port or you may damage the laptop. You will need to buy a USB to serial adapter.

If you just want to cheap out on a headset, buy one of the Microsoft Lifechat USB headsets. They work pretty well.

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