Thetis v2.8.11 - UPDATES and current issues

DO2ZA Erwin
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby DO2ZA Erwin » Tue Aug 24, 2021 4:20 pm

Hello Ritchie,

I found the "Bug": Database seems broken!!

I testet with the Database from 21f, then all works again.

Puuh, I hate it to build the database new.............

Sorry for the Waste of Time Ritchie.

73 Erwin
Anan 7000DLE MK2 black, P.2 v2.1.18, WIN 10, 10.0.18362 (1903), i7-7700 @3.60 Ghz, 2x Monitor 24"@144 Hz and 1x 32" Monitor @120 FPS for Thetis
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:20 pm

DO2ZA Erwin wrote:Hello Ritchie,

I found the "Bug": Database seems broken!!

I testet with the Database from 21f, then all works again.

Puuh, I hate it to build the database new.............

Sorry for the Waste of Time Ritchie.

73 Erwin


Yes I could not replicate it Edwin.

One thing you could try is another CTRL forced DB import/merge to see if it cleans anything out, but I don't have high hopes for that improving anything.

R.
DO2ZA Erwin
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby DO2ZA Erwin » Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:32 pm

Hi Ritchie,

I build it from scatch, just ready with it.

Thanks again for your Top-Work.

73 Erwin
Anan 7000DLE MK2 black, P.2 v2.1.18, WIN 10, 10.0.18362 (1903), i7-7700 @3.60 Ghz, 2x Monitor 24"@144 Hz and 1x 32" Monitor @120 FPS for Thetis
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby va7qi » Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:48 am

Hi Richie,

I am using the released version of 2.8.11, f/w 2.0b on a 3000 DLE MkII. The button is on the lower right side of the Andromeda display.
Sorry, can't do a screen shot at the moment.

73 de va7qi, ....Erik.
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FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby FM5GB » Wed Sep 01, 2021 4:30 pm

Hi Richie, Hi all,

I am in trouble when using the 32 bit version of thetis 2.8.11 (10/20/20 "legacy" version) with my transverters. It seems the antenna input
to RX1 is not not switched off in transverter operation. This brings a lot of noise making transverter operation impossible.
The 64 bit same version does NOT show this issue. I compared both 32 & 64 bit versions with exacly the same setup.
As the 32 bit causes less processor load on my computer I would prefer to run this one.
(Anan Orion rev 1 board from ANAN 200D with FW 1.9pre4. Win10 64 pro on I7 4770K ,16 GB RAM, 0.5 TB SSD)

Did anyone experience this issue ?

73 Phil FM5GB.
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Wed Sep 01, 2021 5:24 pm

FM5GB wrote:Hi Richie, Hi all,

I am in trouble when using the 32 bit version of thetis 2.8.11 (10/20/20 "legacy" version) with my transverters. It seems the antenna input
to RX1 is not not switched off in transverter operation. This brings a lot of noise making transverter operation impossible.
The 64 bit same version does NOT show this issue. I compared both 32 & 64 bit versions with exacly the same setup.
As the 32 bit causes less processor load on my computer I would prefer to run this one.
(Anan Orion rev 1 board from ANAN 200D with FW 1.9pre4. Win10 64 pro on I7 4770K ,16 GB RAM, 0.5 TB SSD)

Did anyone experience this issue ?

73 Phil FM5GB.


I have not had any experience with an xvtr on the anan with Thetis, so perhaps someone else might be able to help. There are checkboxes on the Ant/Filters tab in setup, which may need enabling, not entirely sure. I would check both of those tab pages and compare against the 64/32 bit versions as they will be using different databases and consequently different config. Interesting that you see increased cpu load when running x64 version on your x64 OS... hmm.

Richie.
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FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby FM5GB » Wed Sep 01, 2021 8:11 pm

Thank you Richie,

you are right there was a missing checkbox (10 m Receive XVTR in Ant/Filters/ Antenna).
Now everything is OK.
I apologize for asking.

But I am still unable to explain the increased processor load (almost twice as much) from the 64 version of Thetis.

Best 73s and regards Phil FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Thu Sep 02, 2021 6:18 am

FM5GB wrote:Thank you Richie,

But I am still unable to explain the increased processor load (almost twice as much) from the 64 version of Thetis.



How are you checking the processor load? task manager or the Thetis status bar? If you are using the status bar, make sure that you are displaying the same % on both the x64 and x32 versions. You can click the % display to select if you want to show whole system load, or just thetis.

perc.jpg
perc.jpg (5.48 KiB) Viewed 7601 times


Other than that I would check that sample rates, display FPS, display engine (if you are using the 2020 unmodified 2.8.11) is DirectX, etc.

R.
Last edited by ramdor on Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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DL2XY
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby DL2XY » Thu Sep 02, 2021 7:57 am

I can confirm the effect of nearly doubling processor load if panafall has no data in displayed range.
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Thu Sep 02, 2021 8:35 am

DL2XY wrote:I can confirm the effect of nearly doubling processor load if panafall has no data in displayed range.


Is the radio turned off? panafall turned off? panadapter scrolled so that nothing is shown? 32 or 64 bit? In other words, how do you obtain 'no data'. I need more info if I am ever going to do anything about it.

The issue I have is that my PC is a bit of a beast, so whatever I do it has very little impact.

R.
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby DL2XY » Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:28 am

ramdor wrote:
DL2XY wrote:I can confirm the effect of nearly doubling processor load if panafall has no data in displayed range.


Is the radio turned off? panafall turned off? panadapter scrolled so that nothing is shown? 32 or 64 bit? In other words, how do you obtain 'no data'. I need more info if I am ever going to do anything about it.

The issue I have is that my PC is a bit of a beast, so whatever I do it has very little impact.

R.


Thetis 2.8.11g, x64, P2, Radio on, scrolled to show nothing (or antenna not connected).
For me its not an issue, just noticed the effect.

Walter
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Thu Sep 02, 2021 10:22 am

DL2XY wrote:
ramdor wrote:
DL2XY wrote:I can confirm the effect of nearly doubling processor load if panafall has no data in displayed range.


Is the radio turned off? panafall turned off? panadapter scrolled so that nothing is shown? 32 or 64 bit? In other words, how do you obtain 'no data'. I need more info if I am ever going to do anything about it.

The issue I have is that my PC is a bit of a beast, so whatever I do it has very little impact.

R.


Thetis 2.8.11g, x64, P2, Radio on, scrolled to show nothing (or antenna not connected).
For me its not an issue, just noticed the effect.

Walter


I cant replicate it here and I just tested the 32bit and 64bit versions (on a 64bit os).

If the panadapter is scaled in such a way to show 'no data' (or antenna unplugged and noise floor is below lower grid value) there will probably be a lower or upper line shown and the line draws will drop from thousands to a single line, so technically should reduce in load (at least in terms of line draw calls made to directX). The waterfall will still run the same colour code, same pixel iterations etc, so nothing will change in terms of load for the waterfall. However if you are using an embedded GPU there may be some impact, who knows tbh. If frame refresh is capped either by the fps setting or vsync then it will always be rendering a frame every 16.6ms if 60fps is used.

Also, if you set at 60fps frame rate, but are frame refresh capped due to the system not being able to draw at 60fps (which would be identified by a red led/box top left if enabled) and everything is moved off the display area essentially reducing the 'work' then draw rate may increase and load the system in another way.

A quick vid : https://youtu.be/ZkHfWrX7PWI

R.
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby w-u-2-o » Thu Sep 02, 2021 10:42 am

I also cannot duplicate the 64 vs 32 bit problem. Processor is an i7-7700k, powerful but not state of the art.

This smacks of an OS problem, maybe a missing 64 bit file of some type.

You can run the SFC and DISM tools to detect and repair OS file system problems:

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-use- ... s-10-image
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Thu Sep 02, 2021 12:55 pm

The only other thing I could think of, is if your system is gpu is bottle necked and preventing the cpu doing what it could potentially be doing. If you then reduce the load on the GPU by dragging everything off 'screen' the cpu could then ramp up because it is not waiting for graphics. Clutching at straws here.

R.
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FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby FM5GB » Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:51 pm

Hi all,

I always use Windows Task manager to check processor load of the various programs running...
EG :
I'm running both Thetis versions with the same adjustments in Setup :
- Sample rates of 1536000 on both receivers, (to monitor most of the 2 m band with my transverter.
- display Bin Width : 11.719 Hz on both....
- All other settings idem.

Both RX running processor load as seen on Task manager (RX1 in FM transverter mode; RX2 on 20 m) :

Thetis 64 bit : 39 to 40 %
Thetis 32 bit : 24 to 25 %

RX1 alone on 20 m :

64 bit : 24 to 25 % (15 -fifteen !- % or more with Thetis Power Off but still window in foreground)
32 bit : 11 to 12 % (1.5 % when Power Off with window open)

So there is a major difference from 32 to 64 bit which I'm unable to explain with my (humble) computer knowledge.
(computer i7 -older generation 4770K- @ 3.9 GHz, 16 Gb RAM, 0.5 Tb SSD; Win 64 bit pro). Graphics : two Nvidia 750 GTX

Other SDR receivers I use like RSPduo, Perseus, Excalibur WR-G31DDC, use ridiculously low processor resources in comparison. Of course they
do not sample at the same bit rate but they yield great user interface and perfect display.

73s Phil FM5GB
DO2ZA Erwin
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby DO2ZA Erwin » Thu Sep 02, 2021 5:11 pm

Hi,

i am running WIN 10 V1903 64bit on a I7 7700 at 4200 Mhz

I see here in the Statusbar around 9-12 % Load with RX1 only, and both RX around 20% max.
If only Thetis is Started and TRX not on, I see 1-2%
Setup: Samplerate 384000 on both
FPS 60
Bin With 2.930 with Hann Window
Waterfall Update 3 Frame (50 ms)

No Transverter here

Ps: my Display is a 43" TV and Thetis is running with 3185x1990 pixels in a Window.

With 32bit it is almost the same.

73 Erwin
Anan 7000DLE MK2 black, P.2 v2.1.18, WIN 10, 10.0.18362 (1903), i7-7700 @3.60 Ghz, 2x Monitor 24"@144 Hz and 1x 32" Monitor @120 FPS for Thetis
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Thu Sep 02, 2021 5:19 pm

Phil,

Try the same tests but with 'Off' selected for the both receivers. Keep the audio etc, but turn off the display for each. Check if this is changing your % load greatly at all.

off.jpg
off.jpg (10.97 KiB) Viewed 7514 times


R.
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FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby FM5GB » Thu Sep 02, 2021 7:40 pm

Hi Richie,

when turning display Off the processor load shows almost no change (less than 1 % which is difficult to estimate because of load fluctuations)
The ratio between 64 & 32 bit remains the same that is 64-bit twice as much load.
My computer is 64-bit unfriendly.

But I can live with this as long as the 32 bit version runs flawlessly with high SR and small Bin Width. Avoiding too high processor load is a must for me because of the heat which is more difficult to get rid of here in the Caribbean.

FM5GB
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Fri Sep 03, 2021 8:16 am

FM5GB wrote:Hi Richie,

when turning display Off the processor load shows almost no change (less than 1 % which is difficult to estimate because of load fluctuations)
The ratio between 64 & 32 bit remains the same that is 64-bit twice as much load.
My computer is 64-bit unfriendly.

But I can live with this as long as the 32 bit version runs flawlessly with high SR and small Bin Width. Avoiding too high processor load is a must for me because of the heat which is more difficult to get rid of here in the Caribbean.

FM5GB


Well that discounts anything to do with directX/display as setting to Off will basically bypass the drawing processes. If you use vac, turn them off and run the tests to compare. Essentially switch off parts of Thetis to try and isolate what might be causing it. Failing that, check bios version for the mobo, for all we know there may be some x64 issue, then windows update.. yadda yadda. Also, comparing apples to oranges is not going to reveal anything of much use tbh.

Cheers, Richie.
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby w-u-2-o » Fri Sep 03, 2021 11:58 am

This has nothing to do with the design of Thetis or the code. It has to be an operating system problem.

IMHO the 32 bit version should be deprecated. While there are a few people downloading it, I believe that is more out of habit and superstition than a real need for a 32 bit executable.

@FM5GB Phil: have you checked out the health of your operating system as I previously suggested? Here's the link again to the Microsoft SFC and DISM tools to detect and repair OS file system problems:

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-use- ... s-10-image
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FM5GB
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby FM5GB » Fri Sep 03, 2021 12:30 pm

I agree Richie,

I do not use VAC for my audio. As I told you I am happy with the 32 bit version.

Scott, I did the checks you told me a while ago : there was no trouble or missing file in the system files.

73s Phil

Update : I rechecked the system : there was a bunch of errors corrections (?) by SFC. DISM did not find any error.
But no luck : 32 bit version has still the half burden on the processor(s)
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:07 pm

Hey all,

Just a work in progress video for 21h. Going to hold off releasing this weekend to let me do a few more things to it. Should be out end of next week if all goes to plan.

https://youtu.be/JrmtShSWryc

Richie.
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby K1LSB » Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:42 pm

Beautiful! Thank you very much!

Mark
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby K1LSB » Sat Sep 04, 2021 12:21 am

Not sure if this has been reported but I can't get Fwd SWR mode to stick in the TX Meter (in the Multimeter window). Every time I press the TUN button the TX Meter in the main window changes to Fwd Pwr (NOTE: I also have my Tune TX Meter set to Fwd SWR in the Transmit tab, if that is of any relevance).

Mark
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Sep 04, 2021 1:10 am

ramdor wrote:Hey all,

Just a work in progress video for 21h. Going to hold off releasing this weekend to let me do a few more things to it. Should be out end of next week if all goes to plan.

https://youtu.be/JrmtShSWryc

Richie.

Very nice!
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Sat Sep 04, 2021 9:48 am

Mark,

TX Meter and Power etc from the Transmit tab Tune group is saved to each TX profile. However looking at the code it is not recovered from there anymore, so the 'highlight tx profile save items' yellow highlighting needs to be removed. That is one thing I found when looking into this and will be resolved for 21h.

Have you tried changing the Tune TX Meter to something else, and back? Changing the meter from the main console window when in tune has the same effect as using setup, however, I have noticed that when tuning, if you move the tx meter (from main console window) to something like ALC or ALC group for example, when you hit tune next time it goes back to ALC and does not obey the config in setup.

R.
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby K1LSB » Sat Sep 04, 2021 12:21 pm

Rich,

Changing the TUN TX Meter to something else and back to Fwd SWR does seem to have fixed the TX Multimeter on the main console -- it stays on Fwd SWR now even thru a session restart.

Thanks for the suggestion,
Mark
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby K1LSB » Sat Sep 04, 2021 1:30 pm

Well apparently I spoke too soon....after a subsequent restart the TX Multimeter has reverted back to Fwd Pwr.

Not a problem, I'll just wait for 21h, thanks Rich.

Mark
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ramdor
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby ramdor » Sat Sep 04, 2021 2:31 pm

Hi Mark,

Just so i try can to replicate this...

1) When you hit MOX what does the TX Meter drop down say (top right console window)?
2) When you hit TUN what does the TX Meter drop down say (top right console window)?
3) What is the config of the Transmit->Tune Meter in setup configured as?

Also, please could you email me your database.xml file from C:\Users\<you>\AppData\Roaming\OpenHPSDR\Thetis-x64 or \Thetis if using x86. Email over on qrz.

Cheers, Richie. MW0LGE
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Re: Thetis v2.8.11 - current issues

Postby K1LSB » Sat Sep 04, 2021 4:56 pm

Rich,

The TX Meter in Setup Transmit tab is set to Fwd SWR.

The main console TX Multimeter is also set to Fwd SWR.

Hitting MOX displays transmitted power (if I'm actually speaking into the mic) and SWR value in the main console Multimeter (as it should). The Fwd SWR setting in main console meter remains undisturbed.

Likewise, pressing PTT acts identically to MOX in the main console Multimeter (as it should). The Fwd SWR setting in main console meter remains undisturbed.

Hitting TUN displays full transmitted power and SWR value in the main console Multimeter, which is the correct behavior since the Transmit TX Meter in Setup is also set to Fwd SWR.

However, as soon as I release the TUN button the main console meter changes to Fwd Pwr.

Database.xml sent via email.

Thanks,
Mark

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