2.6.8

NC3Z
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby NC3Z » Sat Oct 19, 2019 2:50 pm

ramdor wrote:yes this was the hard coded setting before.


Preferred setting then, Normal??
Gary NC3Z
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby NC3Z » Sat Oct 19, 2019 2:51 pm

ramdor wrote:the ALC_GROUP meter, is a sum of ALC and ALC COMP, something that Scott asked for. If above 0db there will be some ALC compression.


Scott - Any words of advise on how we should be using this metering?
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:06 pm

NC3Z wrote:
ramdor wrote:the ALC_GROUP meter, is a sum of ALC and ALC COMP, something that Scott asked for. If above 0db there will be some ALC compression.


Scott - Any words of advise on how we should be using this metering?

First: Brian, thank you for the clarification. I'm pretty sure that packet reordering is needed in Thetis. I know that Warren is away right now and probably not reading this, so don't expect a quick response there.

Second: Gary, I'm not seeing an "ALC Group" meter option in d1, and that's not how I'd recommend it to be implemented anyhow.

The problem is that ALC metering is hopelessly convoluted in PowerSDR and, as a carry over, in Thetis. Any ALC meter on any other radio simply reads from say -30 to +10dB, and it will display ALC action across that entire scale. Instead on PowerSDR/Thetis, the two parts of the scale are split across two meters such that ALC reads up to 0dB and stops, and ALC Comp reads down to 0dB and stops. That's just silly, and makes it difficult to see exactly how ALC is being operated, as you need to look at both meters in turn.

My recommendation is to eliminate the ALC Comp meter entirely and make the ALC meter read above 0dB in accordance with whatever internal data currently drives the ALC Comp meter. There is no need for a third kind of metering. The intent is to simplify, not complicate. However, it sounds like the ALC Group meter is doing what I suggested. If that is the case, delete the existing ALC and ALC Comp, rename ALC Group simply ALC, and enjoy!

73!

Scott
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby NC3Z » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:19 pm

w-u-2-o wrote:Second: Gary, I'm not seeing an "ALC Group" meter option in d1, and that's not how I'd recommend it to be implemented anyhow.


That is because you are using an "old" version of 2.6.8. It was added in D2.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby W1AEX » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:17 pm

The ALC Group metering is a great idea! I love it and the scale is definitely easy to read at a glance while transmitting. Glad you put that idea out there Scott and beautiful implementation Richie!

Hope you are on the mend Richie. I use my injuries to escape chores like washing the dishes and mowing the lawn. I trust you can leverage more play time out of this unfortunate tumble as you recover.

73,

Rob W1AEX
"One thing I am certain of is that there is too much certainty in the world."
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ULTIMAX » Sat Oct 19, 2019 6:52 pm

Richie,

I was using 100W in 20M today with a chosen DX profile, when I went to change to my regular ESSB profile which is set to an output of 35W for the amp the power remain the prior 100W, it won't change to the profile set power , I had to adjust by manually.

Just to mention ,,,Thank you very much to all your efforts

Al
73
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sat Oct 19, 2019 7:37 pm

ULTIMAX wrote:Richie,

I was using 100W in 20M today with a chosen DX profile, when I went to change to my regular ESSB profile which is set to an output of 35W for the amp the power remain the prior 100W, it won't change to the profile set power , I had to adjust by manually.

Just to mention ,,,Thank you very much to all your efforts

Al
73


yes, this was changed in d1, and still really undecided on route to take. Does a TX profile define power output or does each band have a stored power output, because originally, the power stored against per band was overwritten by the TX profile.

In the current implementation the two would conflict. Perhaps it all needs to be redone, and store all power settings for every band, in every tx profile.

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:05 pm

Hi Richie,

Glad to read you are feeling a little bit better. Don't know how I missed your announcement of d2, but I did :cry: Catching up now, though!
ramdor wrote:Also a first pass of a combined TX ALC/ALC_COMP meter called ALC GROUP on EDGE meter only atm (a Scott wish list :) ). Name to be decided on, and perhaps the scaling if someone wants to draw out a suitable scale or give it a name.
Richie: this works perfectly :) Scale should be the same as the existing ALC meter. Anyone pushing ALC beyond +10 is nuts. ;) My recommendation: delete ALC and ALC Comp, rename ALC Group to ALC, and stick a fork in it (although I suppose it needs to be on the other meter style, too).
Something to note. It is quite possible to load your PC in such a way that a thread with below normal thread priority will not 'get a chance' to run, and permanently stay in a suspended state. I noticed this when using JTDX and capped out the decode threads, my PC would load to 100% and the spectrum would stop being updated, everything else in Thetis working as expected. Now there is an option to raise the priority of the draw/render thread so you ensure that the spectrum gets updated. Mileage may vary depending on how you set it, and how powerful your PC is.
Why would this thread need to have adjustable priority? Why not simply make it normal priority and be done with it? I set it to normal.
Also, I wonder what your opinions are on adding a status bar to the bottom of the expanded Thetis window, moving clock, cpu/volts/amps, SEQ errors, PS status, window size etc etc there, all along the bottom.
OK, call me a radical, call me crazy, but how about completely divorcing the controls entirely from the spectral display area? I.e., put the all of the controls for each RX in their own, independent, resizable window, and put each RX spectral display in its own, independent, resizable window. This would then form the basis for adding additional receivers down the road.

73!

Scott
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby W1JA » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:13 pm

Trouble on 60 meters

I notice the following issues:

1. There are band edge markers at approx. 5.351.5 and 5.366.5 MHz. These make no sense for 60m, as there is no actual band. (At least in the U.S.)

2. Various bandstack functions don't work properly.
a. I can delete stack entries 3, 4, and 5, but not 1 and 2.
b. Even though 3, 4, and 5 are deleted, I cannot add any new entries.
c. I can't set any of the entries for the five channels correctly. For example, if I try to change bandstack #1 to be correct for U.S. USB operation (suppressed carrier frequency 5330.5; audio frequency limits of 100 Hz and 2900 Hz) I can do it, but the setting is not saved. The next time I rotate around to bandstack #1, the center frequency is back to 5.332 MHz, and it would be illegal to transmit with this setting.

I have reset my database, and these issues persist.

73, John W1JA. I'm glad you're on the mend Richie.

P.S. I've have noticed these issues just now on d2, but I'm not sure how long the 60m bandstack has been broken. I may not have tried 60m in several weeks.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby W1JA » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:28 pm

w-u-2-o wrote:OK, call me a radical, call me crazy, but how about completely divorcing the controls entirely from the spectral display area? I.e., put the all of the controls for each RX in their own, independent, resizable window, and put each RX spectral display in its own, independent, resizable window. This would then form the basis for adding additional receivers down the road.
Yes. Yes! YES! (Thank you Scott.)
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ULTIMAX » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:31 pm

ramdor wrote:
ULTIMAX wrote:Richie,

I was using 100W in 20M today with a chosen DX profile, when I went to change to my regular ESSB profile which is set to an output of 35W for the amp the power remain the prior 100W, it won't change to the profile set power , I had to adjust by manually.

Just to mention ,,,Thank you very much to all your efforts

Al
73


yes, this was changed in d1, and still really undecided on route to take. Does a TX profile define power output or does each band have a stored power output, because originally, the power stored against per band was overwritten by the TX profile.

In the current implementation the two would conflict. Perhaps it all needs to be redone, and store all power settings for every band, in every tx profile.

Richie.

I'm not picky, I actually think is cool this way, I wanted just mention it to you , but you was aware anyway

Thank you so much for everything you do...73'S
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:58 pm

Hi John, thanks for feedback.

W1JA wrote:Trouble on 60 meters

I notice the following issues:

1. There are band edge markers at approx. 5.351.5 and 5.366.5 MHz. These make no sense for 60m, as there is no actual band. (At least in the U.S.)


I asked in this very thread for people to send me bandplans, but only had one reply. I really dont have the time to collate and search every national radio organisation to limit the bands/edges. If everyone did their own country, it would be a matter of minutes for me to change the data, instead of days to do all the research ;)

I have change the US to the following in d3:

case FRSRegion.US:
band_edge_list = new int[]{ 135700, 137800, 472000, 479000, 1800000, 2000000, 3500000, 4000000,
5330500, 5406400, 7000000, 7300000, 10100000, 10150000, 14000000, 14350000, 18068000, 18168000, 21000000, 21450000,
24890000, 24990000, 28000000, 29700000, 50000000, 54000000, 144000000, 148000000 };

and the existing 60m channelised slices

channels_60m.Add(new Channel(5.3320, 2800));
channels_60m.Add(new Channel(5.3480, 2800));
channels_60m.Add(new Channel(5.3585, 2800));
channels_60m.Add(new Channel(5.3730, 2800));
channels_60m.Add(new Channel(5.4050, 2800));

Please let me know if anything needs changing.

2. Various bandstack functions don't work properly.
a. I can delete stack entries 3, 4, and 5, but not 1 and 2.
b. Even though 3, 4, and 5 are deleted, I cannot add any new entries.
c. I can't set any of the entries for the five channels correctly. For example, if I try to change bandstack #1 to be correct for U.S. USB operation (suppressed carrier frequency 5330.5; audio frequency limits of 100 Hz and 2900 Hz) I can do it, but the setting is not saved. The next time I rotate around to bandstack #1, the center frequency is back to 5.332 MHz, and it would be illegal to transmit with this setting.


Yes I have noticed that 1,2 can not be deleted, I will add it all to the TODO list :)

Cheers,

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby vk1hx » Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:00 pm

ramdor wrote:I asked in this very thread for people to send me bandplans, but only had one reply. I really dont have the time to collate and search every national radio organisation to limit the bands/edges. If everyone did their own country, it would be a matter of minutes for me to change the data, instead of days to do all the research ;)


VK band plans, current as at 5 October 2019. Hope these are useful.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:23 pm

vk1hx wrote:
ramdor wrote:I asked in this very thread for people to send me bandplans, but only had one reply. I really dont have the time to collate and search every national radio organisation to limit the bands/edges. If everyone did their own country, it would be a matter of minutes for me to change the data, instead of days to do all the research ;)


VK band plans, current as at 5 October 2019. Hope these are useful.


thanks :D
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby Joe-W4WT » Sun Oct 20, 2019 12:12 am

I haven't seen this mentioned yet but believe it is a bug. At least I don't think it used to work this way.

When in Split mode listening to two frequencies using MultiRx, turning down the RX1 AF control ONLY turns down the volume for VFO A. I'm pretty sure it used to (and should) turn down the volume for both VFO frequencies.

Great work so far Richie and thanks!

Joe W4WT
Last edited by Joe-W4WT on Sun Oct 20, 2019 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sun Oct 20, 2019 12:35 am

W1JA wrote:2. Various bandstack functions don't work properly.


Hi John,

Just a follow up on the bandstack issues.

I have reinstated/fixed the ability to add, which is done by CTRL+right click a band button. I inadvertently removed the flag to check for control key during the first update about 2 months ago. Not many people add stacks it seems :D

There has to be a minimum of two entries in the band stack
Lock prevents a band stack from being deleted, but not overwritten by the looks of it
There can not be more than 10 in the bandstack

Also fixed an issue where current stack could be greater than number of stack in the list :shock:

And then I find more issues, where you can add multiple stacks for same frequency, yet the lock state doesn't get saved correctly because the DB save code ignores duplicates (band freq check)...... :cry:

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:27 am

.
Hi Scott, aka Mr Crazy'n'Radical ;)

w-u-2-o wrote:Richie: this works perfectly :) Scale should be the same as the existing ALC meter. Anyone pushing ALC beyond +10 is nuts. ;) My recommendation: delete ALC and ALC Comp, rename ALC Group to ALC, and stick a fork in it (although I suppose it needs to be on the other meter style, too).

Ok will put on list, low down for now to re-adjust the scale. It was just easy to slap the 0db in the middle and scale each 50%. My only concern about removing the other two, is that a new user, who follows the great youtube audio setup vids might not realise what has happened. Now of course we could add an option 'Use new ALC meter method' in setup and switch between the two, but yes the other two are redundant really. I didn't really do anything clever with it, just added ALC (or ALC_PK) and ALC_G.

Why would this thread need to have adjustable priority? Why not simply make it normal priority and be done with it? I set it to normal.

Previously it was hardcoded as BelowNormal. The may be a rare case, my 10yr old laptop for example, where having the screen update during heavy cpu load would impact into the networking/audio/etc/etc and potentially cause issues. It might be better on those machines to drop the draw thread right to minimum, because It doesn't really matter as much as everything else? However, it is easy enough to default to Normal in the code and perhaps just leave it there? or change to command line option, hmm.

OK, call me a radical, call me crazy, but how about completely divorcing the controls entirely from the spectral display area? I.e., put the all of the controls for each RX in their own, independent, resizable window, and put each RX spectral display in its own, independent, resizable window. This would then form the basis for adding additional receivers down the road.

Yes, this has been mulling over in the back of my head for weeks. For example, currently the display engine (gdi+/dx) having top/bottom/rx1/rx2 knowledge is just a pita. It should just display one type, be it panadaptor, waterfall, then to make a panafall, stitch two together, allowing for a fallpana (lol) or any combination of anything. It would be a couple of months project to do that conversion, perhaps pencil it in for Thetis 3 ;)

I have also spent some time looking at open source dockable window system, splitter panel controls etc etc with the thoughts of doing something.tm. ;)

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby Joe-W4WT » Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:24 am

I decided to install an old version on another computer and check to see if the RX1 AF control affected both VFO A & B volume when split and using MultiRx and it didn't so it looks like I was in error on that. You have to use each individual volume control. Seems like it would be nice if you could control both perhaps with RX1 AF and then individually also with the small controls near the MultiRx switch. Just a thought.

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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:49 am

Joe-W4WT wrote:I decided to install an old version on another computer and check to see if the RX1 AF control affected both VFO A & B volume when split and using MultiRx and it didn't so it looks like I was in error on that. You have to use each individual volume control. Seems like it would be nice if you could control both perhaps with RX1 AF and then individually also with the small controls near the MultiRx switch. Just a thought.

Joe W4WT


Hi Joe, perhaps right click drag of the RX1 af, or shift drag could also set subrx volume.

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby NC3Z » Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:41 am

ramdor wrote:Hi Joe, perhaps right click drag of the RX1 af, or shift drag could also set subrx volume.


The RX1 "sub receiver" (not to be confused with RX2) does have it's own volume control down next to the MultiRX button. It would be nice if the RX2 AF slider could double as the RX1 Sub RX AF when in MultiRX.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby cLicari » Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:33 pm

W1AEX wrote:
ramdor wrote:
cLicari wrote:Re: the network. The Anan is on it's own subnet and direct to the computer. However, the Ethernet card IS a Realtek TP-Link Gigabit PCI Express card. But it works without issue with P1 and OpenHPSDR 3.6.9. Would you still recommend switching to an Intel card?


honestly, I dont know, it is just interesting that they they were talking about something similar. A coincidence though perhaps? If you could borrow a nic or try another computer/laptop with intel chipset? I wonder if anyone else has similar findings?


Richie and Carl,

Initially, when I set up my second subnet for direct connection to my ANAN I used the motherboard's integrated Realtek network interface port. It worked fairly well but I randomly experienced intermittent pauses now and then when running Thetis. At the time there were some discussions about whether the Intel NIC interfaces were a more viable option due to better drivers plus the ability to optimize the connection with all the settings in the Intel NIC's properties. Being adventurous, I disabled the onboard Realtek NIC in my motherboard's bios and bought and installed an Intel NIC and the pauses with Thetis went away. So... that's my non-scientific anecdotal experience with Realtek and Intel NIC adapters. It might help with pauses, freezing and possibly some dropouts. I have not seen any seq errors with Thetis version 2.6.8 while running the Orion (200D) v1.8 firmware from Rich-N1GP so I'm not sure if the Intel NIC will do anything to stop the "seq" errors.

Rob W1AEX


Rob...
I installed the Intel NIC yesterday afternoon and let the radio run for several hours, unattended at times, and experienced no disconnects. Turned the radio off at dinner time. Later that night turned radio back on and after about an hour had four disconnects, two of which were within seconds of each other. It's like I hit the "Power" button. It locks up, the power button light turns off and the radio relay clicks, like a normal shutdown. It restarts just as easy, click power button and resume operation. If you (or anyone else) have any suggestions to the driver setting changes I'd love to hear them.
Present configuration: FW v2.0 pre2 with 2.6.8 d2
Thx
Carl
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:40 pm

ramdor wrote:.I have also spent some time looking at open source dockable window system, splitter panel controls etc etc with the thoughts of doing something.tm. ;)
Very exciting stuff there, Richie! That sounds pretty wonderful. The tricky bit will be the design and layout of the dockable control UI panel for each RX, of course. TX related controls may need to be federated as well to provide an appropriate level of abstraction. Hmmmm.... ;)

73!

Scott
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:44 pm

ramdor wrote:
Joe-W4WT wrote:...perhaps right click drag of the RX1 af, or shift drag could also set subrx volume.
Richie,

Using modifier keys rather than programmable options or separate controls can make operating the radio difficult for both newbies and experienced users. Too much to remember, and not self-documenting. Hence this is my shameless plea to either a) avoid doing things like that or b) provide menu options or additional controls to support those of us who are too feeble to learn and remember such things :D

Thanks!

Scott
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:48 pm

cLicari wrote:Turned the radio off at dinner time. Later that night turned radio back on and after about an hour had four disconnects, two of which were within seconds of each other. It's like I hit the "Power" button. It locks up, the power button light turns off and the radio relay clicks, like a normal shutdown. It restarts just as easy, click power button and resume operation. If you (or anyone else) have any suggestions to the driver setting changes I'd love to hear them.
Carl,

When did this problem start? Did it start with a certain version of Thetis? Because if it didn't it really smacks of firmware timing issues in the GigE MAC implementation, which has been the primary problem in achieving usable firmware that makes timing on all serial numbers. So if you can't point to a particular version of Thetis where this started for you, it's not really a Thetis problem and doesn't belong in this thread.

I know it can sometimes be difficult to distinguish between Thetis and firmware related issues, but it's really hard that we all try to do so in order that Richie doesn't wind up chasing his tail on stuff he has no control over.

73,

Scott
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby cLicari » Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:19 pm

w-u-2-o wrote:
cLicari wrote:Turned the radio off at dinner time. Later that night turned radio back on and after about an hour had four disconnects, two of which were within seconds of each other. It's like I hit the "Power" button. It locks up, the power button light turns off and the radio relay clicks, like a normal shutdown. It restarts just as easy, click power button and resume operation. If you (or anyone else) have any suggestions to the driver setting changes I'd love to hear them.
Carl,

When did this problem start? Did it start with a certain version of Thetis? Because if it didn't it really smacks of firmware timing issues in the GigE MAC implementation, which has been the primary problem in achieving usable firmware that makes timing on all serial numbers. So if you can't point to a particular version of Thetis where this started for you, it's not really a Thetis problem and doesn't belong in this thread.

I know it can sometimes be difficult to distinguish between Thetis and firmware related issues, but it's really hard that we all try to do so in order that Richie doesn't wind up chasing his tail on stuff he has no control over.

73,

Scott


Scott...

Understood completely. I was hoping it was the NIC but that's been proven not the case. I have tried every FW version and Thetis version. d1 and d2 have been seq error free but still experiencing intermittent disconnects. Where the disconnect problem lies is, apparently, unknown but the NIC issue has been mentioned in this thread thus my posts. Richie has taken us all on a fun ride with the Thetis builds, I'm just reporting my results to the user group, not really expecting or asking Richie to chase it down.
Thx
Carl
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:00 pm

If you have network watchdog turned on (settings,general,hw) then the plug will be pulled (click power off on thetis) if there are no events on the listening network socket (ie no data) for 3 seconds. It is also possible that the function WSAWaitForMultipleEvents is failing outright, which would result in the same thing.

Not that this info helps much to get to the bottom of the problem, but you could run ping in console window just to check that the radio isn't dropping off the network when you see these disconnects.

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby cLicari » Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:24 pm

ramdor wrote:If you have network watchdog turned on (settings,general,hw) then the plug will be pulled (click power off on thetis) if there are no events on the listening network socket (ie no data) for 3 seconds. It is also possible that the function WSAWaitForMultipleEvents is failing outright, which would result in the same thing.

Not that this info helps much to get to the bottom of the problem, but you could run ping in console window just to check that the radio isn't dropping off the network when you see these disconnects.

Richie.


Richie...
Thanks for the info and try one at a time. Network Watchdog was selected on so I'll deselect box and see what happens first. I'll report results back soon.
Thank you Richie,
Carl
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:34 pm

cLicari wrote:
ramdor wrote:If you have network watchdog turned on (settings,general,hw) then the plug will be pulled (click power off on thetis) if there are no events on the listening network socket (ie no data) for 3 seconds. It is also possible that the function WSAWaitForMultipleEvents is failing outright, which would result in the same thing.

Not that this info helps much to get to the bottom of the problem, but you could run ping in console window just to check that the radio isn't dropping off the network when you see these disconnects.

Richie.


Richie...
Thanks for the info and try one at a time. Network Watchdog was selected on so I'll deselect box and see what happens first. I'll report results back soon.
Thank you Richie,
Carl
NX5T


when you come to the ping tests, run one window pining the radio, and one window pinging something else on your network, or on internet.

in my case, i would run...

ping 192.168.0.155 -t
ping 8.8.8.8 -t

Richie.
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Re: 2.6.8

Postby ramdor » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:33 am

UPDATE

Hi all,

Just a couple of updates for (10/7/19) d3.

Please try : https://www.dropbox.com/s/xj30xbrzin4er ... 3.zip?dl=0

I have included a few dll's for completeness this time.

Richie.

(10/7/19) d3
- fix: control + band button right click now adds band stack, accidentally removed functionality in shift key press tidy up in initial beyond 2.6.7 update
- change: all pixel based code for original meter removed, now using edge common function
- fix: current band # can not be greater than the number of stacks in the band. This would happen if last stack in list was deleted and it was the current stack
- add: 12m band edges for Aus/VK (thanks vk1hx)
- add: alc_comp supported in original meter
- fix: cw side tone shift for for display, was using incorrect rx dsp mode
- add: re-added some diag info to seq msg
Last edited by ramdor on Mon Oct 21, 2019 5:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
vk1hx
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:03 pm

Re: 2.6.8

Postby vk1hx » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:43 am

New Zealand (ZL) Amateur bandplans (current as at 2018). Information sourced from the New Zealand Association of Radio Transmitters website.
Attachments
ZL 2018-bandplan.pdf
(2.49 MiB) Downloaded 13 times

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