Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

G3ZQH
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Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:00 pm

I'm considering trying 2m and 4m transverters with my 200D. There are some very cheap options (~US$60) available from here: https://transverters-store.com/70mhz_tcxotr.htm (Transverters Store- Ukraine). Has anyone tried these? The latest versions seem to have a TXCO to cure a drift problem and better output filtering. Alternative units all seem vastly more expensive, although presumably much better quality.

The Transverter Store units require 1-50mW drive, which I believe is available from the 200D.

73 Dave G3ZQH
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Tony EI7BMB
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby Tony EI7BMB » Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:46 pm

Hi Dave , don't mean to hijack the thread but I use the me4t for 4m , works really well and is for sale if its of any interest. Please feel free to PM me with any questions re hook and thetis settings etc no matter what xverter you decide to go for.
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:26 pm

Hi Tony
I'll PM you about the ME4T- I believe this is the older HA1YA unit. For the purpose of this thread (and others who might be interested) it would be useful to hear of your experiences with the transverter. I've been using an RX-888 (RX only) to explore 2m and 4m, both new bands for me. Interested in digital and DX. Now, maybe start on 4m with a small beam in time for Es season in here.
73 Dave G3ZQH
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Tony EI7BMB
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby Tony EI7BMB » Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:34 pm

Hi Dave , its the me4t pro http://www.ha1ya.hu/htmkepek/me4t_protr ... erspec.htm works well with my Anan 7000 mk 2.
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:58 pm

OK Tony, I see the specs seem quite good. Possibly a bit more sophisticated than I need compared with the cheap and cheerful Ukrainian PCB. But I am interested. Maybe PM me a price to see where we're at. Good to know that it works with your 7000 Mk2.
73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby dl4zbg » Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:20 am

Hi Dave,

I have been playing around with a few of these little gadgets e.g.:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/432mhz-to-28mh ... 2749.l2649

https://www.ebay.com/itm/144-432-to-28- ... SwPcZgBI~y

From the design point of view, these seem to be the better ones of the "Ukrainian horde". I have been using both in VHF/UHF contests.

- frequency stability ok for SSB and CW
- RX sensitivity seems acceptable on 2m
- TX needs additional filtering (70cm 404 MHz -45dBc and 2m 2nd harmonic (!!) -45 dBc, 3rd harmonic ok
- TX output is only clean if you run them 10dB below the claimed output
- if you have some understanding and experience of DBMs (7dBm or 17 dBm) you will notice that TX Input specs are not realistic.
- I would not dare to use the older versions without DBMs


*** I almost forgot to mention that I am using the 7000 DLE (very clean at -3dBm to 0dBm output) ***

Now I am using HA1YA on 2m and homebrew DJ8ES style on 70cm. That's another league.....
73

Volker
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Sat Jan 30, 2021 10:35 am

Hi Volker
That is very helpful, many thanks. I see that the boards you used are improved with fewer old style inductors. I was looking just at the Transverter Store, but clearly there are other similar items on eBay which are harder to find. I can't see if the units you listed had a TXCO- this would obviously help with frequency stability. Most likely I will look at 70MHz at first. TX signal purity is a problem. Have you used any commercial filters to help or did you build your own?
73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby dl4zbg » Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:28 pm

Both transverters are rated at abt. +- 2ppm. I can live with their frequency drift (after warming up) quite well.

For 432 I temporarily added this filter:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/433MHz-Remote- ... 2749.l2649

forget about 30dBm power handling capability (kinda chinese humour), overload occurs at 5mW. Might be an SAW filter inside. Now I use it in the RX chain of my current transverter.

this one looks cute:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/144-to-28-21-M ... SwPZxffyb6

I guess it will be good for 2 Watts.

sorry, I have not tried to improve 144 MHz filtering.

73

Volker DL4ZBG/DK0B
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:07 pm

Thanks Volker for the information. It is a bit confusing about the different versions of very similar PCB 'Ukrainian' transverters- I'm not sure I trust all the specifications given on eBay. Have you tried digimodes JT65 or FT8 with the transverters. I wonder if the drift is a problem? A few are quoting 0.1 ppm, but most seem to be 2ppm or more.

I think the drive will be OK from my 200D and if I decide to use a linear amp, I'll need it to work on 1-1.5W from the transverter based on your experience. That is useful to know. I found a couple of useful reviews on YouTube which mentioned the poor IMD unless using low power.

I'm still thinking about this- the low cost of the boards is tempting, but it is possible that I am making myself a lot of unnecessary trouble by trying to save money!

73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:05 pm

Just to wrap up this thread for now. After much searching I have decided to buy the Transverter Store 1ppm TCXO 28/70MHz board. This is less than £50 UK including postage. This is the only unit for 70MHz where I feel confident that the TCXO will be included. I'll report back after I have it working and fitted in a suitable enclosure.
73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby dl4zbg » Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm

Please post your experiences and (if you have measuring devices) the IM3 values of the transmitter. On 4m large signal behaviour of the receiver might be less important.

73

Volker
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:46 pm

Now I have my 70 MHz Ukrainian Transverter built and boxed. So far RX is not working, but I have TX output. The board is well built, but the main problem is with interfacing since there are no RF connectors attached to the board and the output pins are very small and difficult to make soldered connections.

Questions for ANAN transverter users:

1. What are your settings to avoid 28MHz TX at same time as XVTR TX output. I cannot find the right settings. I have set up XVTR window with 'XVTR RF TX' and 'Disable TX ticked'. Also 'Disable HF PA' ticked under Ant/Filters. But I still have RF out from the main antenna socket as well as from the XVTR TX. Is this a firmware or Thetis bug as I have seen others reporting similar observations?

2. On XVTR RX (I am using separate TX and RX) I have no 70MHz signals but there is some 'noise' from the transverter. Again, would appreciate settings that others have used successfully

3. I have 'Out of Band' in Thetis on 70MHz, not sure why? I think Tony EI7BMB had this problem as well.

I have not done any detailed measurements on the TX quality except to see that I can easily achieve 1-2 W output and that there is a significant 2nd harmonic detectable on 140MHz. I don't have a spectrum analyser, so can't say more than that at this stage. I have a 70MHz linear amp built, and it is possible that the filtering on that will give me a clean enough signal. No IMD measurements yet but looking at CW/datamodes initially (not SSB/FM where IMD is more important)).

Any help/advice welcome.

73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby dl4zbg » Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:46 pm

Hi Dave,

please take a look at my settings:

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=3097&p=7615&hilit=transverter+dl4zbg#p7615

Don't forget the checkbox "XVRT" ! Without this one checked reception is "zero"
"Out of band": change your region settings to "extended"

73

Volker
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:12 pm

HI Volker
Thanks. My settings on XVTR tab are the same as yours. My 200D has slightly different settings on the Ant/Filters page as below but I believe with the same effect as yours.

I am beginning to wonder if the 4m band has any activity! Usually I would al least expect some local FM but all I see are what look like spurious peaks. I also swapped the transverter RX to the main 200D ANT1 input and this gave the same results. So, at this stage I'm not sure if it is the transverter or my settings or just no signals on the band.

Regarding 'extended' I already had this checked.

The main PA TX (which should be disabled) does not give full output, it is about 10% of normal power, so there is a partial effect of the PA disable setting. I can drive the transverter by having an antenna or dummy load connected to the main TX, but this doesn't seem right...

A bit frustrating, but I'll keep going.

73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby FM5GB » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:41 pm

Hi Dave !
I had the same issue with my 200D. You must install protocol 2 firmware : Orion_NP_v1.9_pre3metis.rbf. Previous versions did NOT work properly. This last version implements PA disable function correctly. To be downloaded on Github.

73s. Phil FM5GB
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Fri Feb 19, 2021 11:55 pm

Hi Phil
Where did you find the download for Orion_NP_v1.9_pre3metis.rbf? I am on v1.8. I can't see at the usual download location on Github. Is it a special version? Can you send me a copy if you have it?

I have the transverter working well now with just two problems. Firstly the unwanted TX on 28MHz and secondly some 100Hz spurs which appear to come from my 12V PSU.

73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Feb 20, 2021 12:08 am

Not sure where "pre3" is at, but all other versions can be located here: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=3309
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby FM5GB » Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:13 pm

Sorry Dave,

the last version of firmware for your 200D is Metis_Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4.rbf which you may download from
Scott's link.

Please tell us it works for your setup.

73s Phil FM5GB
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Re: Ukrainian transverters- anyone tried with ANAN radio?

Postby G3ZQH » Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:53 pm

Perfect! Thank you Phil and Scott. Now I have full TX inhibit. I don't know how I missed this firmware update. I've been using v1.8 for a long time.

I still have the problem with 100Hz spurs on my 70HMz TX signal from the transverter, but that is another problem, not for this forum.

73 Dave G3ZQH

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