New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

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Until such time as the New Protocol firmware goes into general release, all discussion will be concentrated here.
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FM5GB
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby FM5GB » Fri Aug 20, 2021 8:37 pm

Thanks you guys !

I will open my radio this weekend and doublecheck all the connectors, wiring and solder joints ect. The rig is fully home made so I know wherre I am going. I will report my findings and possible cures.

Great to have you...

73s Phil FM5GB
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby W3MMR » Sun Aug 22, 2021 9:39 am

I did NOT have good luck with the new firmware update on my 200D. First thing I did, and the only reason I wanted to try the new firmware, was test PureSignal. I use VOX on SSB, and noticed that right before the radio would unkey, (does this on PTT too), the panadapter data line will rise up on either side of the transmitted pass band. SO I tried a 2 tone test and noticed that anything above about 60w, you can hear popping in the tones, you can see the data line correspond with the "pops" as they happen (data line drops down). I also noticed that at close to full output , probably from 80 to 100 watts output, the correction really goes down. The 2nd tone is only about 20db down with the new firmware and close to 30 or more with the old firmware, Orion_1.9.1.4.

Perry
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby FM5GB » Mon Aug 23, 2021 3:08 am

Hi all,

I think I solved the problem which occured after flashing FW 1.9.15.rbf on my Orion board.
After investigating the whole sunday I finally was almost convinced I had a thermally related issue.
Freezing of Thetis (32 as well as 64 bit) occured some minutes after a cold start and almost
immediatly when the radio was warm. Maybe FW 1.9.15 was heating the FPGA too much. But when I reverted to previous
versions of protocol 2 FW the trouble remained the same...
So I had to dissassemble the radio and test the Orion board on my bench.
- all 3 power rails (from my home made linear power supply) are OK
- there is no visible damage or bad solder joint.
- all electrolytic and tantalum caps were good on my RLC meter (cap value and ESR) I noticed one capacitor (C250 a 100µF 35v) which
had been hand soldered (flux still present) but the guy was good.
- the FPGA heat sink is getting quite hot (55°C on the IR thermometer). When the board is uncovered on the bench the Thetis freeze needs over 30 minutes to occur.

So I decide to put a dedicated fan over the heat sink (similar to the one which I removed some years ago because of the noise) and miracle cure : the radio works again as it should even in a hot room with no air conditioning and for several hours. I selected a relatively silent 12V 40x40 mm fan in my junk box. (there is a photo on my QRZ page).

I hope this fix will last or is it possible that future P2 firmwares will heat the FPGA even more ?

One last remark : why does the 64 bit version of Thetis use almost twice as much processor as the 32 bit version on my system ?(W10 pro 64, old I7 4770k processor @ 3.9 GHz, 16 Gb ram ,0.5 Tb SSD).

73s Phil FM5GB
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Mon Aug 23, 2021 5:25 am

W3MMR wrote:old firmware, Orion_1.9.1.4.

Perry

Which firmware is this one Perry? I've not seen this one released.

If you have a copy would you mind sending to me via email please? my callsign AT Hotmail DOT Com.
Last edited by vk1hx on Mon Aug 23, 2021 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Mon Aug 23, 2021 5:38 am

FM5GB wrote:
One last remark : why does the 64 bit version of Thetis use almost twice as much processor as the 32 bit version[/b] on my system ?(W10 pro 64, old I7 4770k processor @ 3.9 GHz, 16 Gb ram ,0.5 Tb SSD).

73s Phil FM5GB

Hi Phil,

Glad your progressing with solving the FW issues. As for Thetis x64 using more CPU that x86, I've noticed about the same CPU load no matter which version of thetis I use. The only slight reduction in CPU load has been seen with the Thetis 2.8.11 (21g) update from Richie.

I find if you play with display settings (increase / decrease the Bin width) in Thetis and or refresh rates (higher) can have an impact on CPU load. My monitors are 144hz and I run them at full refresh rates, I run a Bin Width of 2.9 on RX1 and the same settings for RX2.

My system specs are high (i9 - 9900K, nVidia RTX2700, 32GB Ram, SS-970 m.2 drive etc) however I do try to reduce overall load where I can. I also run Windows 10 LTSC for much less windows bloatware.

2a.JPG
2a.JPG (15.99 KiB) Viewed 17724 times
Last edited by vk1hx on Mon Aug 23, 2021 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby DL8LAQ » Mon Aug 23, 2021 9:36 am

FM5GB wrote:Hi all,
- the FPGA heat sink is getting quite hot (55°C on the IR thermometer). When the board is uncovered on the bench the Thetis freeze needs over 30 minutes to occur.
...
So I decide to put a dedicated fan over the heat sink (similar to the one which I removed some years ago because of the noise) and miracle cure : the radio works again as it should even in a hot room with no air conditioning and for several hours. I selected a relatively silent 12V 40x40 mm fan in my junk box. (there is a photo on my QRZ page).
...

Hi Phil,
maybe your fan does not only cool down the fpga but the phy U13 as well.
I have had a few ANANs on my bench with ethernet problems. One could not run P2 f/w, even if ping did work. I checked U13 soldering under a microscope and found very bad solder joints. One pin was moving free. After reflow of U13 P2 f/w did work perfect.
73, Norbert - DL8LAQ - ANAN-G2 w/display - Richie's latest Thetis version and pihpsdr by N1GP&DL1YCF
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby FM5GB » Mon Aug 23, 2021 7:22 pm

Same old story...

After having the radio running several hours the disappointment was enormous : Thetis froze once more. The cooling measures
taken didn't do the job. though it improved things some what
I have no other mean to check and repare the Orion board (microscope, reflow tools ect). The FPGA or another chip may be faulty. So the game is over for me with Anan-Thetis. I will not invest in "new" Orion board which would be another waste of time & money. This 7 year old board is no more in production and replacement by a mark II board is not an option for me.
Maybe you hear from me on another brand.

End of story.

Phil FM5GB
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby w-u-2-o » Mon Aug 23, 2021 8:35 pm

Wishing the best of luck to you in the future, Phil.

Building your own radio from almost scratch is a labor of love. It certainly is easier to use a store-bought radio. You can probably duplicate the receiver performance you have, but nothing can match the transmit performance of an openHPSDR radio running Thetis and PureSignal.

After you get your new radio, you might consider sending the Orion board out for repair, just like you might do with any other radio.
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby n1gp » Mon Aug 23, 2021 8:59 pm

Hey All.

Phil, sorry to hear about your 200D. I hope you can get someone to look at it.

I can confirm I was seeing hash on the spectrum with 1.9.15 and 1.9.16:

ScreenShot-17.jpg
ScreenShot-17.jpg (119 KiB) Viewed 17670 times


Better with v1.9.17:

ScreenShot-18.jpg
ScreenShot-18.jpg (116.7 KiB) Viewed 17670 times


I have a new 200D FW image for you all to try. I tried to make timings as close to
the Metis_Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4.rbf in the DSP area (not ethernet) so I'd be interested in both how this new one works
for those who 1.9.15 and 1.9.16 didn't, and also those who either 1.9.15 or 1.9.16 did work.

FW v1.9.17:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9yufs3dr9wi1m ... 7.rbf?dl=0

-Rick / N1GP
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby G3ZQH » Mon Aug 23, 2021 10:29 pm

Hi Rick
Just some quick feedback on 1.9.17. I have no RX signal on any band and when I try to TX I get sequence errors and erratic RF. When tuning across the band I see strange artefacts and some signals but ONLY when tuning. After a few minutes Thetis crashes. So, not so good on my 200D compared with 1.9pre4. I'll try again tomorrow with Bootloader just in case there was a problem with the FW loaded from HPSDRProgrammer
73 Dave G3ZQH
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby FM5GB » Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:34 am

Anan 200D vs FW Orion_NP v1.9.15 (and up ?) season 2 : a solution ?

After having been discouraged and depressed because of this last episode I decided to try another trick before
throwing my radio into the trashcan. I'm a stubborn guy...
As I told before after flashing v1.9.15, I could not get out of the trouble even when reverting on v1.9pre3, nor pre4...
That's why I maundered around : the thermal status of the FPGA has its part in this mess; no doubt ,but it's NOT the primary cause.

By looking to the file size of the different P2 firmwares I noticed that v1.9.15 & v1.9.16 are sized well over 1900 kB while all other
are around 1680 kB. So I decided to go back to Orion_NP_v1.3 which is the second biggest file (1869 kB). I wanted to be sure to overwrite
the flash memory of the FPGA which might have been incompletely erased by bootloader.
Under v1.3 the problem was gone despite 30+ °C in the shack. Then I went back to v1.9pre3 (was the last good for me).
And things now run flawlessly (I hope I will not be disappointed tomorrow Hi)

Conclusion v1.9.15 does NOT correct timing issues on ALL 200D's It may also give you some sleepless nights.
Dave you should revert too.

73s Phil FM5GB

Update August 24th : the Orion board runs flawlessly now with no problem at all. Still a big difference between Thetis 32 & 64 bit (64 b consuming twice as much processor resources).
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:06 am

n1gp wrote:Hey All.
I have a new 200D FW image for you all to try. I tried to make timings as close to
the Metis_Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4.rbf in the DSP area (not ethernet) so I'd be interested in both how this new one works
for those who 1.9.15 and 1.9.16 didn't, and also those who either 1.9.15 or 1.9.16 did work.

FW v1.9.17:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9yufs3dr9wi1m ... 7.rbf?dl=0

-Rick / N1GP

Hi Rick,

I loaded the Orion_NP_v1.9.17 FW on my 200D. Unfortunately it wasn't as good as Orio_NP_v1.9.15. I experienced the TX audio issues I had under FW v1.7, v1.8 (really bad), the v1.9_pre series. Its an audio tale/hash like feedback sound after speech. I have the noise gate on my audio profiles (DEXP) so it eventually cuts out. If I disable the Gate the audio artifact keeps going. It's like there is way to much audio gain on TX. Anyway I've reported that in a number of posts before. Its not overly as server as before with FW Orion_NP_v1.9.17, however Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4 was better in this area.

I didn't get any SEQ error, PS seemed to work normally across most bands.

I've reloaded FW Orion_NP_v1.9.15 and went straight into TX and all was perfect.

Again, IMHO, there is a definite need for 2 or 3 versions of the P2 FW for 200D series ANAN's based on the revision series of the PA board, unless there is a difference in the Orion boards? Interesting Rob - W1AEX and I have a 200D, Rev.24 version and experience the same issues with FW.

I loaded Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4 FW on my mates 200D (running the Rev.16 PA board) and its been flawless for him. v1.9.15 and v1.9.16 was no good. Haven't tried v1.9.17. He's happy to stick with the one that's working.

Thanks again for your efforts with FW development.
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby n1gp » Wed Aug 25, 2021 1:13 pm

Phil,

Tnx fer checking these out. I'll keep working on it. Maybe some day there'll be a version
that works on all the 200D's.

Rob - W1AEX and my 200D seem fine with 1.9.15, versions previous though would work on
mine and not his. Many versions :(

73's

-Rick / N1GP
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Wed Aug 25, 2021 1:45 pm

Yep agreed.

Mine is also rock solid on v1.9.15.
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby W1AEX » Wed Aug 25, 2021 4:38 pm

Rick,

Looks like we have the same budget spectrum analyzer. I checked my 200D running Thetis v21g with v1.9.15 P2 firmware loaded and as can be seen in the screenshots below it looks very clean with a carrier and also with the 2 tone test using Pure Signal. During both sweeps below the ANAN was running at my amplifier driving power of 50 watts.

I have not yet checked v1.9.17 but I suspect that I will have identical results with what Phil observed since it appears that our Orion boards are identical twins.

73, Rob W1AEX

Orion v1.9.15
Image

Orion v1.9.15
Image
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby n1gp » Wed Aug 25, 2021 8:19 pm

Rob,

Tnx for the update. It's looking good on your budget analyzer :)

-Rick / N1GP
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby W1AEX » Thu Aug 26, 2021 4:13 pm

Hi Rick,

A quick update on v1.9.16 with my edge case Orion board: Thetis could not find the radio and the radio would not return a ping from a command prompt. Looks like my FPGA has trouble with communication through the ethernet port with v1.9.16. Bootloader discovered the MAC address instantly, as expected. I re-flashed v1.9.16 on the chance that something happened during the previous flash but the behavior was the same after the second flash.

I moved to v1.9.17 to see how that would play: No SEQ errors seen but PS would not correct on any band. Thetis reported good feedback but Ampview displayed a very distorted phase and magnitude graph.

I moved back to v1.9.15 and everything is perfect again, in fact my coffee even tastes better with this version!

Thanks again for all your work (and amazing patience) with the Orion firmware.

73, Rob W1AEX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:34 pm

W1AEX wrote:
I moved back to v1.9.15 and everything is perfect again, in fact my coffee even tastes better with this version!


Ha ha ha, classic. :lol:
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby SM7SJR » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:07 pm

I have an issue. My old 200D, which is one of the first revs seems to not like the 1.9.15.

It runs for a few hours and I can run QSOs with it and then all of the sudden I get seq errors and the rig "dies" in Thetis. I press power and it starts but then it fails again shortly thereafter.
I was at 2.8.11 with Thetis and the k7 upgrade. I went back to 2.8.11 but it did not help, now I am back with FW at 1.9.pre4 and it seems to be ok.

I have another 200D which is a bit newer rev. I have now run 1.9.15 on it for a day, not TXing much but it has been on for a day and seems to work ok.

Would like to run latest FW on both of them. Any ideas?

73 de SM7SJR, Bjorn
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby w-u-2-o » Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:15 pm

It's almost certain that you cannot run the latest on both of them. The older hardware likes the timing solution of 1.9pre4 better. There is nothing you can do to fix this except maybe add more cooling provisions to the older hardware, since it seems it will run 1.9.15 when it's colder.

While there are some bugfixes in 1.9.15, it's unlikely you will see their effect compared to 1.9pre4. The only thing you might notice is that the older firmware does not report its full version properly in Thetis.
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby SM7SJR » Thu Dec 30, 2021 9:50 am

Interesting to see is that I get hangs on my other 200d also , so went back to pre-4 on that rig as well and now it is stable. Not sure about the rev for that rig but it should be newer than my first rig. Do we know from which rev of 200s the 1.9.15 runs stable?

Edit: After having the 200d powered on for several hours I got problems with pre-4. 1.9.15 is more problematic. Any suggestion? Go to pre-3, and if so where to find it? Or is there a 1.9.16 around?
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby w-u-2-o » Thu Dec 30, 2021 2:46 pm

SM7SJR wrote:...Do we know from which rev of 200s the 1.9.15 runs stable?

There really isn't a point at which the hardware became different somehow and it works with 1.9.15. If my previous post (from October!) gave that impression I apologize. It's totally random what firmware will work with what serial number. If you can't get something to work with 1.9.15, or pre4, you just have to keep trying older and older versions and hope something will click. Or control power supply voltage. Or control temperatures.

See also this recent post: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=4004
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby vk1hx » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:03 am

SM7SJR wrote: Do we know from which rev of 200s the 1.9.15 runs stable?


P2 Firmware v1.9.15 runs well on my ANAN 200D with Rev.24 PA board.

Orion_NP_v1.9_pre4 was ok my my 200D but not as good.

I have a friend with a 200D with Rev.16 PA board and he can't run v1.9.15/16/17 either. I think he is running pre4 or 3. If your having issue with pre4 then suggest you try Orion_NP_v1.9_pre3. I can email the firmware file to you if needed?
73, Phil - VK1HX
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby SM7SJR » Sat Jan 01, 2022 3:46 pm

Hello Phil,

Thanks for the offer. I actually got the newer 200 working with 1.9.15 , if I leave the 200 powered on for some time until I start Thetis it runs ok. So we can skip the pre3 for now.

I do not know the revs of my 200s, I am a bit lazy to disassemble them (I guess that is the only way to find out). BTW the 1.9.16 or 17, I have not seen any links to them?

73 de SM7SJR
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Re: New 200D Orion Protocol 2 Firmware Topic

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Jan 01, 2022 4:45 pm

If you are using EXT for external PureSignal feedback you have a Rev. 15 or 16 RF board. If you are using bypass for same you have a Rev. 24 RF board. However it matters not with respect to firmware as the Orion board rev. is the same in either case.

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