Implementation of Pure Signal by Dr. Pratt in other radio

[JJ4SDR]

A fellow ham flagged this the other day.

Click link below:
https://www.ol-power.com/sdr-en.html

Actual launch of the hardware forthcoming.

73!
Juha
NI2M

[Trucker]

Doctor Pratt's WDSP library ( including Pure Signal) is available in several open source applications. Do a Google search on Github and you will see several projects that have used it or tried to.
This particular SDR sounds like the 7000DLE MKII architecture. The bandwidth per receiver to be displayed is the same as is currently available in the Anan radios.
I couldn't find any pricing or ordering information on the website. It's too bad they don't give any more details of the actual hardware itself.
James
WD5GWY

[JJ4SDR]

Thanks James, for reminding me of the library!

Juha

[w-u-2-o]

It's more than that.

First, remember that "the radio" is primarily contained in software element. The hardware element is little more than the front end and the first IF conversion. That means that any SDR that provides an appropriate feedback path and utilizes Thetis (or even PowerSDR mRX PS) will implement PureSignal. Hardware that supports this includes all from Apache, Hermes Lite 2, TRX Duo, Red Pitaya, and probably one or two others that I'm not thinking of. However few of these options involve the slick advertising to be found on the Olliter web site.

Second, it would appear that Olliter is developing derivative works of both the openHPSDR hardware and the Thetis software. Indeed, the Thetis implementation appears to be highly modified. This begs the question of whether they will abide by the Gnu licensing and make the schematics and source code public.

[Trucker]

It will certainly be interesting to see where they go with this. I have bookmarked their website to try to keep up with development of their new SDR.
James
WD5GWY

I realize that the hardware is only a portion of the "radio " in an SDR radio system.
I guess the G2 Saturn is a radio as everything is contained in a single enclosure,including a traditional knobbed interface if wanted. Just as the Andromeda is a self contained system.
Anyway, many, myself included, find it easier to refer to our systems as radios.
YMMV

[W1AEX]

Chas - K2BU mentioned this platform to me on the air several weeks ago. As Scott noted it will be interesting to see how the release of the OL Master software will be handled given that elements of the open-source work created by developers of the Thetis project are present in their software. One limitation of note is that currently the maximum sampling rate is 192 kHz which may or may not be a deal breaker for some operators. If it gets off the ground I'll look forward to hearing one on the air!

73, Rob W1AEX

[K1LSB]

I do believe it would also be the only other radio besides the Anan that is capable of true Diversity receive (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

I use Diversity so often that I'll never own another radio that doesn't offer it.

Mark

[laurencebarker]

192KHz.... sounds very like our protocol 1 implementations.

[Trucker]

192KHz.... sounds very like our protocol 1 implementations.

That's what I thought as well. Maybe, it is just the beginning of what they plan to do.
James
WD5GWY

[Trucker]

Go to this link:
https://www.ol-power.com/sdr-en.html

Scroll down to the tabbed selections and select Specifications.
Then look at the application screenshots. The settings pages are identical to those in Thetis with very little differences. Also, there is a page for pricing and availability. No pricing yet. But, availability shows September 2024.
In the Specifications tab it shows a max receive display bandwidth of 1.5Mhz. (If I understood it correctly)
Very wordy descriptions. But, very little detail on what FPGA is being used.
They claim 20,000 hours of development time for the application. From what I can see, interface is where they spent a lot of time. And the internal processing, given some of the screenshots, is lifted from open source software like Thetis.
James
WD5GWY

[K1LSB]

I'm also keen to see how the software is going to be offered for release, given that it clearly incorporates Dr. Pratt's PureSignal algorithm, and especially if it includes cmASIO and/or Richie's new meters.

Mark

[w-u-2-o]

It's clearly a fork of Thetis, if the web ad copy is to be believed.

[DH1KLM]

Olliter actually wanted to come onto the market with the SDR in 2021. The general delivery problems in the electronics industry led to an Efinix FPGA (dont know the model anymore) being used instead of the ALTERA Cyclone 10CL120YF780I7G. Of course, this change required an adjustment of the circuit etc. and that was obviously time-consuming.

For information, here are 2 Powerpoint presentations showing the original project.

[w-u-2-o]

I put the question to Olliter on their Facebook page and they are definitely playing it cagey

https://www.facebook.com/Olliter

[Tony EI7BMB]

Hi Scott, not seeing your question on their page, maybe they edited? Also some contradictory posts about pre booking being open or not. Not exactly inspiring confidence

[w-u-2-o]

It's still there. Look in the comments section of their latest post.

[Trucker]

It's still there. Look in the comments section of their latest post.

I have looked through several of the posts on their Facebook page. Some of them show several comments. But, when you look at the comments, nothing is showing. I make sure to select Show all comments. And still the same results. It would appear that you asked a sensitive question that they don't want to respond to. Or have others reading.
Not a good sign in my opinion.
James
WD5GWY

[K1LSB]

Many comments there aren't visible to me but I don't have an account there.

Mark

[Tony EI7BMB]

Same here Mark, listing says 7 comments but not showing here even after i "liked" their page. Must be some weird facebook thing

Edit: The one comment I saw yesterday is now not appearing, maybe Oliter are hiding/deleting them ?

[K1LSB]

I put the question to Olliter on their Facebook page and they are definitely playing it cagey

https://www.facebook.com/Olliter

For those of us who can't access your question on Facebook, can you tell us what you asked and what they replied?

Mark

[w-u-2-o]

Capture.JPG (120.26 KiB) Viewed 1503 times

[K1LSB]

Thanks Scott.

So I went searching for some insight as to how the GPL license might be applicable (or not) to any specific derivative work and found this:

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm ... id=2622355

In that paper, Sections 3.2 and 3.3 appear to be the most relevant to the instant case, depending on how Olliter packages and distributes their software (i.e., as a single executable, or possibly with separate modules or plugins).

Mark

[W4WMT]

If by "core software" they mean WDSP and ChannelMaster, I don't see how they can keep it private under the terms of GPL 2.0.
In fact, I believe they are required to release the source code concurrently with the executable object code (as we do on GitHub).
Although, I am definitely NOT a lawyer!

73

[w9ac]

If by "core software" they mean WDSP and ChannelMaster, I don't see how they can keep it private under the terms of GPL 2.0.
In fact, I believe they are required to release the source code concurrently with the executable object code (as we do on GitHub).
Although, I am definitely NOT a lawyer!73

The main issue is one of global enforcement. GPL 2.0 is rooted in antiquated 1991 license terms. The world has significantly changed since then, and frankly GPL has morphed into a nice "gentleman's agreement" with no teeth toward global accountability.

Even when there's clear IP infringement, it takes a treaty to bring a claim into a court of competent jurisdiction. In the U.S., just try and hale a defendant into court across international borders by invoking a long-arm statute. A perfect example is the complete disregard for our IP by many eastern Asian countries.

Paul, W9AC

[W4WMT]

And since you ARE a lawyer, I really appreciate you chiming in, Paul!
In other words, GPL is mostly there just to keep the honest folks honest.
Alas
73